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BatiGoal

How To Nurture Talents


How To Nurture Your Talents

 

Let me take you on a little experiment I did the other day. I went on a journey with 4 talents I had in my squad in order to find out which specific journey works best for their development. It works really simple. I inherited a very strong squad in FC Barcelona and the sheer talent in that squad is mind-blowing. Setting up a formation and tactics is pretty easy with that sort of quality in the squad but with an eye on the future as well I wasn't sure what the best path was to take for some of the other players. Once the starting 11 are set and the bench filled with subs for all positions, what do I do with the 'leftovers'? Just leave 'em there? Throw them into the Reserve Team? Loan them out?

Well, to be fair, they aren't exactly 'leftovers', they're talented players that we need to keep for the future but since the competition is immense at certain teams such as Barcelona it may take a season or two before they're ready to become a regular or even a key player for the team. In the meantime? We have three options

  1. Join The Reserves
  2. Keep in the squad
  3. Send on a loan spell

Let's meet our talents!

 

Our GoalKeeper

GKstats.png

Only 1 GK at the time on the pitch. Our friend Jose Aurelio Suarez has competition from A.Ter Stegen, J.Cilessen and J.Masip. That's lots so I'm taking Jose on 3 journeys and I'm eager to find out which one's going to make him a better Goalkeeper.

 

Our Defender

Dstats.png

No lack of competition here either. T.Vermaelen, S.Roberto, G.Pique, J.Mascherano, J.Alba, J.Mathieu..our defender Umtiti looks really nice with many 13s and 14s. Let's bring friend #2 on this journey with us in order to find out what suits him best.

 

Our Midfielder

Mstats.png

Looks great. But..He's no S.Buquests, no A.Iniesta, no A.Turan and no I.Rakitic. But he could very well be one day. He's a really promising talent so let's take this midfielder and friend #3 on this journey as well.

 

Our Forward

Fstats.png

Great numbers here. If you find a way to implement him into your formation then that's settled. But what if you can't guarantee playing time with guys like Neymar, L.Messi, L.Suarez, Rafinha and others already in your team? This is going to be our 4th member for this all-revealing journey.

 

The Journey

The journey is very simple as I explained earlier. These 4 players happened to be on the wrong side of the cut but the manager has big plans for the future with this group. They need to develop into mature players and be ready when they're called upon. The first journey is taking them 1 full season into The Reserves (Barcelona B). They'll be getting plenty of games versus weaker opposition but the amount of gametime may just be what these talents need. The second journey will keep them with the squad and while training with the very best in the world is very educational, the lack of gametime opportunities may very well stagnate their development, or part of it. The third journey will split the group. Each will go on a seperate adventure to a new club (on loan) where they'll get new teammates and play regular football in a top division against top opponents.

Let's start this experiment with our GK, followed by the CD, the CM and lastly our F.

 

GK - Jose

GKgamesnew.png

Jose played nearly every game in The Reserves, 0 games with the main squad and 39 games on loan with Rayo Vallecano. Where did he learn the most? Let's look at those digits below.

 

GK3saves.png

Far right column are Jose's starting attributes. His technical attributes developed nicely in save 2 and 3. No difference there which is perhaps surprising. Mental attributes actually decreased in save 2 and 3 which to me is odd but telling. Physical attributes increased really well in save 3 with strength being really useful for a GK on certain ocassions. I would therefore say the Jose's third journey has been the most succesful one.

 

CD - Samuel

Dgamesnew.png

Samuel joined Barcelona B and played only 23 games due to injuries. Second journey took him to the main squad where he played nothing. Third journey was with Sporting Gijon where he managed 30 games in total. Which journey was best for him?

 

D3saves.png

Far right his starting numbers. He did ok in The Reserves, better with the main squad but clearly the best in save 3, on loan. Physical attributes jumped up, mental ones too in 'decisions' and 'positioning', which are pretty crucial for defenders. What about 'passing' and 'tackling' for his technical attributes. Those went up nicely so that's pretty clear that once again save 3 wins it.

 

CM - Andre

Mgamesnew.png

Same as the others. Started at the Reserve Team. 29 games versus weaker opposition. 15 goals. Very good for a midfielder I'd say. Then main squad, 1 game there. Lastly, Sevilla which are a strong team so that's perfect getting 29 games there. Let's look at the numbers.

 

M3saves.png

You can instantly see too much blue on the two most right columns. Then save 2 and 3 are close but the physical attributes' improvement in save 3 nicks it. Quite significant ups too with +2 +2 +3 for 'strength', 'stamina' and 'pace' respectively. That's a lot in 1 season. Small wins on mental and technical attributes too makes this an clear win for save 3 again.

 

F - Paco

Fgamesnew.png

Same journey here apart from the loan spell. Reserves brought him a massive 38 games with a whopping 29 goals. That's great despite the weaker league. Then main squad. Just like our CM, 1 game. Then the, what's becoming clearer, all-important loan spell with Valencia. 30 games and a chunk of goals. What do the stats have to say?

 

F3saves.png

First thing I see are those physical stats. Save 1 (The Reserves) are instantly out of contention. Mental stats are better in save 3 and so are the technical ones with 'shooting' being one of the most important for our forward. 'Technique' up as well and so is 'teamwork'. Great up in 'pace' btw during his loan spell. There's no question here. Save 3 wins!

 

Conclusion:

There's not a whole lot to conclude here anymore. I think we all know that playing your talents regularly at your very club is the best for their development. If they're just lacking that quality or maturity in the first few seasons then placing them on the sub bench + regular playing time is a fantastic alternative. But if you happen to have "too many" talents which is a welcome luxury of course then looking at our 4 friends' journeys the loan journey is the best option. I think the reason save 2 (staying with main squad) won it over The Reserves is because the 4 were probably too talented for a lower division playing weak opposition so there was little to learn for them in the end. They had quality players on the training ground to work with on a daily basis which proved more educational. I'd like to put the latter on a test for future expirements as I think there's more to take from these but for now I think I can safely conclude that opting between going to Reserves, the squad, and on loan, the loan spell is the best choice for your future stars.

 

Thanks for reading and feel free to drop a comment, opinion or experience.

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I think you should test it with a team that don't have a B team since the game simulates reserve game time for them and you don't get to know how they performed or how many games they play 

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14 minutes ago, Dar J said:

I think you should test it with a team that don't have a B team since the game simulates reserve game time for them and you don't get to know how they performed or how many games they play 

We can always do additional experiments :) but it seems to me that if players are too talented then they are better off staying with the squad then being thrown into the reserves.

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This is a fantastic test. Kudos. Unfortunately you picked a bad time for it as it appears that the reserve/team B may be bugged at the moment. Not sure how widespread it is but I would like to direct your attention to this thread.

https://community.sigames.com/topic/393151-player-progress-on-team-b/

Regardless though, the game seems to mirror real life in that loans with playing time are best. 

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9 minutes ago, veerus said:

This is a fantastic test. Kudos. Unfortunately you picked a bad time for it as it appears that the reserve/team B may be bugged at the moment. Not sure how widespread it is but I would like to direct your attention to this thread.

https://community.sigames.com/topic/393151-player-progress-on-team-b/

Regardless though, the game seems to mirror real life in that loans with playing time are best. 

Haha Thanks mate, I'll have to redo this time-consuming test once they claim to have fixed it. I do believe that improvements in B- teams are slow and better suited for below 3-star talents tho.

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How old are the players you're testing? Do you notice that younger players improve faster than older players or is general development more linear?

And lastly, if you do re-run the test, I think it may be more indicative if you use players who aren't maxed out on CA/PA. I believe when CA is maxed that they're basically as good as they're going to get (not including relatively minor age related improvement for younger players). 

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5 hours ago, veerus said:

How old are the players you're testing? Do you notice that younger players improve faster than older players or is general development more linear?

And lastly, if you do re-run the test, I think it may be more indicative if you use players who aren't maxed out on CA/PA. I believe when CA is maxed that they're basically as good as they're going to get (not including relatively minor age related improvement for younger players). 

These players are approx. 20yo and youngsters generally improve faster which is no surprise. The ones I used aren't maxed out btw they are 3-4 stars.

 

4 hours ago, PriZe said:

Quality content as always m8! Hats off for you sir

Thanks mate. Perhaps no surprising results to most but still good to re-confirm things now and again. And especially the difference between the options.

 

3 hours ago, rseven said:

All control by AI?

Yes. 

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The player development in AI controlled team is different with human controlled team. Because we can train players.

 

Edited by rseven
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1 hour ago, BatiGoal said:

These players are approx. 20yo and youngsters generally improve faster which is no surprise. The ones I used aren't maxed out btw they are 3-4 stars.

That's not how it works.  They are maxed out for how far they're going to develop (not including minor age improvements).  

PA shows how good they can be compared to the rest of the players on the team based on the coach's opinion (so they will obviously never be 5-star on Barcelona as long as Messi & Co are around).  CA shows how good they are now.  So if CA==PA then that means that the player is basically at his skill ceiling.

And if you put that Barcelona youngster on a lower division side, they'll be 5* instantly in the opinion of that team's coach even though their actual skill hasn't changed.

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1 hour ago, rseven said:

The player development in AI controlled team is different with human controlled team. Because we can train players.

 

That's why I kept things even by holidaying thru. Would've been skewed otherwise. The effectiveness of trainings intensity- wise is a different experiment altogether.

 

15 minutes ago, veerus said:

That's not how it works.  They are maxed out for how far they're going to develop (not including minor age improvements).  

PA shows how good they can be compared to the rest of the players on the team based on the coach's opinion (so they will obviously never be 5-star on Barcelona as long as Messi & Co are around).  CA shows how good they are now.  So if CA==PA then that means that the player is basically at his skill ceiling.

And if you put that Barcelona youngster on a lower division side, they'll be 5* instantly in the opinion of that team's coach even though their actual skill hasn't changed.

I know how it works. It really doesn't need to be that complicated. They're simply players who aren't featuring in the starting 11 or sub bench. So sending them out on loan at a suitable team which play a level suited for their quality is in most cases best for their development. It's that simple.

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56 minutes ago, Jack said:

Quality content, thanks for sharing.

Thanks Jack. Altho I'm a liitle disappointed the Reserve Teams aren't doing what they're supposed to be doing at the moment. So the results aren't reflecting the contrast between the different options accurately enough.

Oh well, that means more experiments to take and more articles to write once we get the next 'fix' in.

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Great work, very detailed and answers such a common question. Only thing is I would say is playing once in the squad may not be enough. Would be good if he played 5-10 times or as a sub but obviously not as much as on loan as that would defeat the point.

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55 minutes ago, Dec said:

Great work, very detailed and answers such a common question. Only thing is I would say is playing once in the squad may not be enough. Would be good if he played 5-10 times or as a sub but obviously not as much as on loan as that would defeat the point.

Thanks Dec.

I generally keep 1 talent and 1"more seasoned" player for each line on the pitch. I try to give those talents at least 10-15 games/season. If that number ends up being under 10 they're imo better off on a loan spell.

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5 minutes ago, lm10 said:

from my own experiences too i think sending them on loan is the best option

There seemed to have been issues with the reserve teams before I ran these tests which according to SI have been fixed now. So I may have to redo this whole experiment at some point.

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